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Well, I think those were normal Thunderbolts aboard those Omega-x destroyers.

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And I'm pretty sure Nials are stronger, weapons-wise, than T-bolts. The Minbari in general have stronger weapons and the like, I see no reason why it wouldn't hold true for Nials as it does for Sharlins

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EA may have better sensors now but no way does it affect Minbari Sensor technology

Oh and I have that severed Dream ANimation...its very very good...

and can you upload that clip somewhere for me mobvekhar ?

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Last edited by Londo Molari on 11-03-2001 at 10:23 PM

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Actually in year 2264 EA sensors can track Minbari ships.
I don't know when EA sensors were upgraded to this level, but I assume it was soon after the EA joined to ISA.

I hope you know what "Into the Fire" is... or was...
Anyways, one of their writers has released possible mission scripts for ITF, they are not canon because the game is dead.

But because they was supposed to be seen in the game, I consider them as canon.

http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/

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Londo: I can't upload it, maybe someone else can do that for me?

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Hell all I know is that if a T-Bolt can destroy a Vorlon Lightning fighter it can waste a Nial with less difficulty and that is undisputed because no way in hell is a Nial better than a Lightning.

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ah, maybe I'll watch ITF again, thanks anyway mobvekhar


and as for the T-bolt, yeah Lightning better than nial, but the T-bolt vs Lightning wasnt a fair fight... it was a lucky shot...Vorlon fighter was probably alrdy damaged... and since Vorlon Fighters are so big t-bolt could aim easily...Nials harder to aim at.

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Ghost Rider
Hell all I know is that if a T-Bolt can destroy a Vorlon Lightning fighter it can waste a Nial with less difficulty and that is undisputed because no way in hell is a Nial better than a Lightning.

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True, mind you, it's still a difficult task to take out either

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Londo: I knew you were going to give me the old Lightning was probably already damaged and T-Bolt got off a lucky shot excuse. Jesus for once just accept that humanity is not as inferior as you'd all like to believe.

Yes, both the Nial and the Lightning are superior so what? The Shadows are extremely older and more advanced than the Vorlons by a lot, they were the second race after Lorien's and the Vorlons who were the youngest of the First Ones kicked the Shadows' butt almost every time. Their fighters and Ambassador transports could bring down the giant Battlecrabs with ease for God's sake. Just because a race is older or more advanced doesn't automatically make them better all the time (ahem, Vietnam...). Even Rome fell from its glory after its Golden Age, as have all supreme Empires throughout history and they've always have been brought down by others who were once inferior to them.

Alpha: Make no mistake I didn't say it would be easy to take down a Nial (And lets not get into that human vs Minbari argument again ). I said it would be easier to take down than a Lightning, big difference.

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Fighters by their very nature are easy to take down IF you hit them. Just because a Lightning was taken down doesn't mean that the Thunderbolt is better However, the Thunderbolt is pretty advanced and at least similar in capabilities to the Nial.

The problem about hitting other fighters lies in the sensors and in the pilot skill. Minbari and Vorlon sensors are better than EA's but supposedly human fighter pilots are very skilled, will lots of combat experience.

I have no idea whether the Thunderbolts were upgraded against the Whitestars but normal Thunderbolts should be able to do some damage, again if they hit.

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Last edited by Triggy on 11-04-2001 at 02:21 PM

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what do you think a tunderbolt would look like with shadow spines? lol I think it would look. ummmm weird

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quote:

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Originally posted by MCO Strife
what do you think a tunderbolt would look like with shadow spines? lol I think it would look. ummmm weird

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alright maybe I was wrong, that is sweet can I get one for my birthday, lol

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hmm, might be an idea for a possible Telepath War Campaign, shadow enhanced auroras and thunderbolts.....

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now that is a good suggestion perhaps someday we will see it

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Ghost Rider

Alpha: Make no mistake I didn't say it would be easy to take down a Nial (And lets not get into that human vs Minbari argument again ). I said it would be easier to take down than a Lightning, big difference.

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I know, I was agreeing with that, just mentioning that it'd be tricky to take out either one

Of course, the other possibility could be balancing - the Nial is better all-around balanced, wheras the Lightning packs a lot more punch, but is easier to take out. Kind of like a fragile sledgehammer, if you see what I mean

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i would have to say weapons power is not an issue - any of the younger races faighters can destroy eachother - minbari fighters were destroyed by the non upgraded starfurys with 1 shot - hell the toughest fighters seem to be the auroras - they can survive being hit by minbari capital ship beams =) but only if it clips them lol - but i think its mroe speed and maneverabilty that count - so the nail is certainly better than the t-bolt but the t-bolt is still a fast and manverable fighter and unlike minbari fighters it can take missiles which could give a desisive advantage in combat
as for the vorlons being way behind the shadows i would disagree with that strongly - a battle crab barely strached the vvorlon dreadnaught - there fighters whiped out another and a vorlon transport ship took out a battlecrab with 1 shot - so better armour - better weapons the ulimtate example of this is the planet killers - shadows just nuked them - hell we can do that but the planet was still there just cratered - vorlons can blow the whole planet away - turn into an asteroid belt - that s major weaponary it also took the co,mbined firepower of teh first ones quite some time to destroy it too. nope the vorlons kick ass - they may not be as old but they are toughters

there phyical if you can call it that bodys seem to be unkillable by younger races - it took kosh to kill kosh2 - shadows a quick blast froma ppg rifle does the job

the vorlons also invented 3rd space and kicked the asses of the 3rd space aliens while fighting there own people too

3rd they defeated the shadows time after time and haven't had the thousands of years hiding and recovering they have been evolving further if i was picking side the vorlons would whip the shadows assess

vorlons rule

and cant remmber if it was this thread or not but ea sensors were upgraed long before isa - the amamenon was adapted to detect white stars and minbari ships and it was said its sensrs were long in need of an overhaul - sheridan asked what kind of sensors they were using to track the minbari ships - because they had obviously developed a countermeasure they just hadn't gotten it fully deployed yet

and weapons power the GOD satelites main beam is more powerful than the sharlins and the warlock has 2 of them upfront

wooooohoooooo give the ea afew years to build upa fleet of them and the ea could probally take the minbari specially if we build afew more victorys but replace the poxy green beams with warlock ones =)

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Those poxy green beams on the Victory can slice open a Drakh Mothership. Watch ACTA, the Victory sliced a Drakh Mothership apart with those things.

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[QUOTE]Originally posted by KillMeNow
[B]as for the vorlons being way behind the shadows i would disagree with that strongly - a battle crab barely strached the vvorlon dreadnaught - there fighters whiped out another and a vorlon transport ship took out a battlecrab with 1 shot - so better armour - better weapons the ulimtate example of this is the planet killers - shadows just nuked them - hell we can do that but the planet was still there just cratered - vorlons can blow the whole planet away - turn into an asteroid belt - that s major weaponary it also took the co,mbined firepower of teh first ones quite some time to destroy it too. nope the vorlons kick ass - they may not be as old but they are toughters




Havta remember though, Shadow vessels are much more maneuverable than their Vorlon counterparts (except maybe the little destroyer/transport thingy). In terms of sheer firepower and hull strength, yeah, the Vorlons probably win there. However, those strengths can be offset by the Shadow's ships being more elusive. Vorlon ships (especially the dreadnought) are fairly clumsy and probably would have great difficulty bringing their main weapon to bear on an evading Shadow vessel.
Secondly, Shadow ships are more capable of sneaking up on their targets. A Vorlon ship obviously has to open and exit a standard jump point which opens a slight window of opportunity for it's opponent to detect and evade. On the other hand, Shadow ships enter and exit hyperspace nearly instantly and without any sign of their empending arrival. Should a Shadow ship appear on any side of a Vorlon dreadnought and stay there, my money is on the Shadow vessel winning.
Vorlon weaponry could also be seen to be somewhat vulnerable. Knock one of those tenticles off a Vorlon ship and it could severely disrupt the forming and effectiveness of it's weapon.
Finally, in the 1st engagement between Vorlon and Shadow forces it isn't clear if those Vorlon fighters destroyed that battlecrab. For all we know those fighters may have just been stinging that Shadow ship, destracting it until a larger Vorlon ship could finish it off. As far as I know a group of Vorlon fighters were NEVER seen actually killing a Shadow ship.
In conclusion, I still believe the Shadows to be superior to the Vorlons in most regards. If the Vorlons are as powerful as they appeared to be then they should've decisively beaten the Shadows long ago, with the help of the other First Ones. I still think there is a lot we don't know about all sides, probably never will know.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Mr. Fury


http://koti.mbnet.fi/~fury/08_2001_full.jpg

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