Registered: Aug 2001
Location: Chichester, United Kingdom
Posts: 189

This might be a long way off at the moment, but if you intend to do any engagements during President Clark's leadership, maybe you could do something about the liberation of Proxima 3.

If I remember correctly, that had the Whitestar Fleet (comprising 30 ships), and - between Sheridan's forces and those loyal to Clark - 8 EA Nova/Omega warships apiece with their respective Starfury squadrons (36 fighters per warship).

I just thought this might be a good battle to have, since there was a lot of internet speculation about President Clark being controlled by the Shadows.


(Sorry, I accidentally put this as a New Topic, and not part of Triggy's 'Any Requests?' topic)!!!

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Last edited by Tiletron on 10-24-2001 at 11:04 AM

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Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Finland
Posts: 576

Yeah, 8 omegas, 30 whitestars and 8X32 starfuries, sure thing.

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 256

if you do 14 starfurys per omegas, it can work I think

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Registered: Jul 2000
Location: The Cold Northland!
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Definately a mission I plan to build

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Nottingham, England
Posts: 1470

I'm sure that the Team's campaign will be quite thorough with the missions, say about a dozen of them for the EA civil war as most are quite recreatable and that release is basically the most important one of them all! Of course, any opportunities to produce any episode-linked missions I'm sure will be taken at the first possible opportunity.

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Registered: Oct 2001
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Posts: 114

Actually the batlle on Proxima had 30 White Stars vs 6 Omega Destroyers: the EAS Heracles, EAS Juno, EAS Vesta, EAS Pollux, EAS Furies and the EAS Nemesis, and though only 1 WS was shown being destroyed, the one that spirals into the Pollux, the synopsis states most WSs were destroyed leaving about six with damage and that's becuase the Juno leaves the fight shortly after the WSs begin the attack, the Vesta and Furies don't fire.

Again I ask the team to include EA Liberation Forces in the campaign, I know the series only showed Sheridan's WSs but I'd like to see Novas, Hyperions, Olympus and Omegas flying with me too.

And I know what the AoG team has said about the Poseidon Carrier coming after the Civil War. I'm not convinced in the least by their explanation though, and I'd still like to see it in the Civil War if possible. I hope someday soon to see that ship in the models list on your site like the Bin'Tak, Octurion and other B5 Wars ships you put in. Just a humble request.

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Nottingham, England
Posts: 1470

I can't comment on how many Whitestars were destroyed other than to say that Whitestars are definitely a better combat vessel than Omega Destroyers and remember 'Between the Darkness and the Light'. Here only 20 Whitestars took out all six Omega-X Destroyers with 14 casualties and the Omega-X vessels are massively upgraded Omega Destroyers. Therefore 24 lost out of 30 Whitestars against effectively three Omega Destroyers does not ring true. In both cases presumably full Thunderbolt squadrons were used by Clark's forces.

Although the one shown may not be the only Whitestar destroyed, there wouldn't have been many taken out.

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Registered: Oct 2001
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Triggy my friend remember the WS is not the finest piece of machinery built contrary to popular belief. The synopsis for "Between the darkness and the Light" states only 3 WSs survived the fight with the Omega-Xs and one of those 3 was left dead in space. The synopsis for "No surrender, no retreat" states of the 30 WSs about 6 or 7 were left and only 1 Omega was destroyed, the Pollux. The advantage the WSs have is in their numbers and of course maneuverability. But essentially the heavy numbers they attack in. A WS vs an Omega 1 on 1 is no match, I'm sorry WS lovers it's the truth. Also in "Severed Dreams" the initial strike by Loyalist forces showed 2 Omegas and 2 Hyperions in the attack. After the jump in the 2 Hyperions mysteriously disappeared but we know they were there and were destroyed. Just because an episode didn't show it, doesn't mean it didn't happen. The WS is designated as a Monitor, this means its a small patrol ship like a Corvette, I agree it has much better firepower than a normal ship of its size but if you even out the sides the WSs are no real match for Omegas. Of course I know no one is going to believe me and there's sure to be a number of posts contradicting what I just said but I did read the numbers in the official episode synopsis.

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: barrow in furness
Posts: 138

but didn't the omega x's have a slight problem, most of the targeting equipment didn't work right and they had to be fired manually? I heard that somewhere I cant remember where

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Registered: Jul 2000
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I didn't hear that. I think thats idle speculation.

I have to agree, the WhiteStar isn't so super that it bests an Earth Alliance destroyer. Its extremely good, its very powerful, and its small and fast, but nothing in B5 is everything. You'll notice that JMS makes sure that there are no true absolutes. The Shadow war was won, but at what cost, the Drakh plague has a cure, but there is a deadly side effect (one we don't know about yet), so on and so on. The WhiteStar fits with that framework. It is a super ship, but its not so super that its invincible.

This is what will be reflected in the balancing of this MOD. The WhiteStar will be one hell of a ship, but not so incredible that a major capital ship with fighter escort can't defend itself.

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Registered: Feb 2001
Location: Joutsa, Finland
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... And that's why Sheridan wanted a bigger warship that can kick serious butt.
I'd say he pretty much got what he wanted...

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Registered: Apr 2001
Location: Finland
Posts: 576

Ok, let's put it this way:
Yes, an Omega can take out one Whitestar easily, but no, 3 Omegas can't take out 24 Whitestars, that's just insane. Also remember that the Omegas probably had to aim manually, which wasn't all that easy.

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Registered: Apr 2001
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The liberation of Proxima will be in the EA Civil War campaign.
I saw this ep a hundred times and I have figured out the positions of the vessels during battle , as well as the attack :

1st wave consist of Whitestars. Drops out behind the planet and draws Nemesis and Vesta away from Main fleet.

2nd wave drops out between Nemesis , Vesta and the other Omegas. This wave is the main Wave. All Whitstars

3rd wave drops out of JUMPGATE the rest of the whitestars and the all the fighters.

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Registered: Mar 2001
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AOG gives the Whitestar a combat point rating of 800. The Omega's rating is 950 and I think the Omega-X was 1800. Just what AOG had as far as overall vessel worth.

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: barrow in furness
Posts: 138

still it's going to be fun seeing one whitestar thinking it's so tough then a beam from an Omega-x cuts it in half

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Registered: Oct 2001
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OK, I'll accept that the Omega is beter in combat than the Whitestar. Also, I never said there weren't any extra Whitestar casualties but this battle was dictated by the Whitestar fleet and the Whitestars weren't trying to destroy the Omega Destroyes, just disable them. That takes a lot more precision, you can't just slice bits off of the Destroyers.

I would like to read this synopsis, could anyone tell me where it is?

Those combat ratings seem about right for small engagements, especially given that in fleet battles Whitestars become less effective due to losing some of their individual manoeuvrability. BTW when I said better combat vessel I didn't mean that they could take on an Omega one-on-one, just that they have more flexibility of tactical use.

IMHO the actual armaments of the Whitestar and Omega are not too different in power but differ in numbers of weapons and ability of the targeting systems. Of course, any good hit on a Whitestar will destroy it but an Omega could take several.

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Registered: Aug 2001
Location: Chichester, United Kingdom
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What about that episode when Delenn first met with a Drakh Emissary and his mothership. The Whitestars didn't seem to lack manoeuverability when they did that 'Skid Dancing' technique.

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…though we are not now that’s strength which in old days moved Earth and Heaven, that which we are, we are.

One equal temper of heroic hearts, made weak by time and fate, but strong in will, to strive, to seek, to find…and not to yield.

Tennyson.
-------------------------------------------------
[url=http://starwars-tpmtc.fateback.com/index.html]'Star Wars Phantom Menace TC'[/url] for Jedi Outcast (Co-Leader, Modeller, Webmaster)
[url=http://ja.ravencommunity.net]'Star Wars: Jedi Apprentice'[/url] for Jedi Outcast (Co-Leader, Modeller, Scriptwriter)
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Registered: Jul 2000
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quote:

---

Those combat ratings seem about right for small engagements, especially given that in fleet battles Whitestars become less effective due to losing some of their individual manoeuvrability. BTW when I said better combat vessel I didn't mean that they could take on an Omega one-on-one, just that they have more flexibility of tactical use.

---

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Registered: Sep 2001
Location: Estonia
Posts: 1362

what is AOG and please give me the website adress

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Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Nottingham, England
Posts: 1470

Oh yes! The spinning star manoeuvre is way cool (I have no idea how that would ever be represented in the mod though).

The AoG website is http://www.agentsofgaming.com hope that helps

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