VWBB - Volition's Todd is a SMARTEY

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- General Discussion (http://volitionwatch.papageorgefamily/vwbb/forumdisplay.php?forumid=7)
-- Volition's Todd is a SMARTEY (http://volitionwatch.papageorgefamily/vwbb/showthread.php?threadid=8268)

Posted by ThresholdRPG on 02-20-2003 01:41 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Todd

Comparing us to Bioware is unfair. Bioware is the exception. Not many companies to that level of customer relations. Find an EA company that does that level (EA is basically the top video game publisher right now) of customer relations. You probably can't.

Firstly, EA sucks big time. They are the WORST game publisher right now. Everything they touch turns to crap. When I read that Microsoft might be purchasing Vivendi's gaming division (Blizzard, Sierra, etc), the only news I read that was worse was that EA was also in the bidding.

Second, you are right it is unfair to compare Volition's customer relations to Bioware. Similarly, it would be unfair to compare the football skills of Ryan Leaf to Joe Montana. The reason it is unfair is not because there is no basis of comparison, but because one is EXCELLENT and the other is non existent.

Third, I have already stated numerous times I really love the Summoner games. Heck, I own Summoner 2 for *TWO* platforms! The point I am making here is that Volition is HURTING itself by refusing to make ANY efforts to build a community around its franchises.

quote:
Originally posted by Todd

We do customer support for Summoner2. If someone emails the webmaster, I respond if at all possible, or I redirect them to someone who can respond. There's probably 15 message boards floating around for our games, how can I be expected to visit those and keep up with them on a regular basis, AND get all my work done? Expecting us to offer some kind overwhelming support, on a 3rd party message board, is just asking for way too much. People who don't read this board have no problem emailing the webmaster, but you seem to have that problem... I can't help you.

Todd, it appears you did not read my posts about this.

First, you shouldn't have to go to 15 3rd party message boards. Volition should have OFFICIAL forums that are actively followed. Then people can go to one place and Volition only has to check that one set of forums. This would be MORE efficient because frequently asked questions would be searchable there, and other customers could help each other. That is called having a COMMUNITY.

Second, it is actually very easy to take steps to minimize flaming and such on official forums. A host of methods have already been listed here.

Third, Volition should have people whose job it is to deal with customer support. Expecting PROGRAMMERS to devote their free time out of the goodness of their hearts to peruse message forums is unfair to the employee. Yes, this involves costs, but the point is that good customer relations = more sales. The concept pays for itself. See companies that have good customer relations for PLENTIFUL examples of this.

Fourth, having official forums is not "overwhelming support." It is BASIC support.

Fifth, emailing a web master is not a DISCUSSION. Emailing a webmaster does not create community.

Sixth, the issue here is that the method that exist now do not build a community. As a result, nobody knows about your games. You say Summoner sold more on the PS2 than on the PC. Well why do you think that is? Nobody in the PC market has even heard of Summoner or Volition. The fault there lies with Volition's lack of community building and not with PC customers.

__________________
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Threshold RPG - Where Role playing isn't a feature, it's a requirement!

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Posted by Remora on 02-20-2003 03:05 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by ThresholdRPG
Volition should have OFFICIAL forums that are actively followed.

They did. They are now gone, mostly because of belligerent asswipes.

If you are so great at marketing and supporting games, why don't you send THQ your resume? Volition is just a dev studio, they don't have to provide an atmosphere ... that's what THQ is for.

Posted by Knight Templar on 02-20-2003 04:30 AM:

quote:
Volition should have OFFICIAL forums that are actively followed.

Dude, where are you from? That was like, so last year.

__________________
"Luck of da Irish... BIOTCH!!"

Posted by Todd on 02-20-2003 05:06 PM:

feh. i'm done with this, its an unwinnable argument.

Posted by Remora on 02-20-2003 05:10 PM:

at least this thread is named for you!

Posted by Todd on 02-20-2003 05:20 PM:

And in that way, I do feel special. In a special kind of way.

Posted by Slasher on 02-20-2003 05:31 PM:

They mean "SMARTEY" in a non-derisive way I'm sure.

Posted by aldo_14 on 02-20-2003 11:36 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Xanthen

Well, the answer is, they don't specifically say only people with 1 year experience will be hired (some don't anyway), they say entry level programmers or people with 1 year experience. Which means your competing with people with 1 year experience, not to mention all the other entry people who want to get a job. So to be the one hired, you have to show them your better than nearly all the other applicants. The top few they will bring in for an interview and then they'll hire from that group.

<snip>

Thanks... I've not actually done very much with games-related stuff (even my Graphics class is Java based, which is why I'm intending to spend this summer with a book and a copy of C / C++ / C# and learn more graphics API-specific programming), but it's probably the most interesting field, simply because you can do (IMO) anything, but it has to be done fast (AI, physics, etc). Which seems fun. (especially compared to spending a working life bugfixing applications or something....).

Either that or Embedded Systems Programming, which I did really well atlast semester(albeit it's conceptual stuff I've been learning, rather than specific practical stuff)... I'm pretty hopeful I can finish next year with a good honours pass (been averaging about 80-85% marks in exams over the last 2 1/2 years), and Strathclyde has a good reputation in the UK atleast, so hopefully I can get my foot in the door

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Posted by Xanthen on 02-21-2003 05:29 AM:

Well, one thing I said turned out not to be true. I went up to rent an apartment in Champaign today. Quite frankly, I'm shocked at how much higher it is. Its not like Champaign is surrounded by water or mountains. Its just cornfields. I'm going to be spending 709$ a month for something I could get down here for 450$ a month. Just something I needed to rant on.

Posted by ThresholdRPG on 02-21-2003 05:57 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Remora

They did. They are now gone, mostly because of belligerent asswipes.

If you are so great at marketing and supporting games, why don't you send THQ your resume? Volition is just a dev studio, they don't have to provide an atmosphere ... that's what THQ is for.

Why would I do that when I am the President & CEO of a successful gaming company that has been making online RPGs for over 7 years?

Sorry, I'm not interested in working for someone else when things are going quite well presently.

Lastly: Why did someone edit the title of MY thread. That is really uncalled for.

__________________
-Aristotle

Threshold RPG - Where Role playing isn't a feature, it's a requirement!

http://www.threshold-rpg.com

Posted by ThresholdRPG on 02-21-2003 06:00 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Todd
feh. i'm done with this, its an unwinnable argument.

Well, you are right that it is unwinnable. It is an undefensible position for a company *NOT* to invest time and effort into building community around its franchises.

Please recall that my motivation here is a desire for the Summoner franchise to be MORE popular and get MORE sales. I think it totally deserves to be a bigger name in the RPG genre, and I think one of the big things holding it back is the total lack of customer support and community building.

I do not know why you seem to be taking this as an attack, when it is a constructive suggestion.

__________________
-Aristotle

Threshold RPG - Where Role playing isn't a feature, it's a requirement!

http://www.threshold-rpg.com

Posted by aldo_14 on 02-21-2003 11:09 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by ThresholdRPG

Well, you are right that it is unwinnable. It is an undefensible position for a company *NOT* to invest time and effort into building community around its franchises.

I think the point is that V is owned by THQ, so it's really up to THQ to provide that whole area of service et al. As they're (THQ) catering to a mass-market (especailly compared to PC), and a very fast changing one at that, customer service does tend to get deprioritised IMO.

Think of it this way - how many movies or albums get recalled and altered by their creators as a result of customer feedback? That's the way I feel the console market will go. i'm not saying it's a good thing - it's just what I can see happening in future as consoles become more and more mass market.

Posted by Remora on 02-21-2003 04:52 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by ThresholdRPG
Why would I do that when I am the President & CEO of a successful gaming company that has been making online RPGs for over 7 years?

Sorry, I'm not interested in working for someone else when things are going quite well presently.

We are happy for you ... what puzzles me is why you're concerning yourself with other corporations' policies (and hence, your COMPETITION) when you have your own to run.

quote:
Originally posted by ThresholdRPG
Lastly: Why did someone edit the title of MY thread. That is really uncalled for.

I'll edit whatever I need to ... and you presume too much when you claim ownership to anything on this site. Read the [url=http://www.volitionwatch.com/vwbb/register.php?action=aug]user agreement[/url].

Once again, I will state the obvious to the rest of us because you seem to be uninformed.

1) This is *NOT* Volition's bulletin board.
2) Volition does *NOT* have to read this board, or "support" anything ... they are a dev studio, THQ takes care of the PR stuff.
3) Feel lucky that we, Volition Watch, have good relations with some Volition employees ... and hence, they post here.
4) Don't make assumptions about my intentions. You break the [url=http://www.volitionwatch.com/vwbb/register.php?action=rules]rules[/url] (see #3), I ban you. Consider this your warning.

And finally, your questions have been answered cleanly and concisely. Move on.

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Posted by Stealth on 02-21-2003 06:20 PM:

*looks at website*

under "Downloads" what's that client? i was expecting a demo

so tell me where i can get one of the games you've made

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Posted by Todd on 02-21-2003 10:19 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by Xanthen
Well, one thing I said turned out not to be true. I went up to rent an apartment in Champaign today. Quite frankly, I'm shocked at how much higher it is. Its not like Champaign is surrounded by water or mountains. Its just cornfields. I'm going to be spending 709$ a month for something I could get down here for 450$ a month. Just something I needed to rant on.

That's true. But its not hard to find a hell of a lot cheaper around here. If I recall overhearing (heh), you're in Gentry Square where Nick Lee is. That's in/right next to a very nice neighborhood. One of the more expensive housing hoods in Champaign (if you can call any housing hoods in Champaign expensive..). so its not much of a surprise its that expensive. I live in an apt. actually _in_ that same neighborhood (you're more or less right on the edge) and I only pay about 50 bucks less. You're apt. is prolly bigger

Posted by Knight Templar on 02-22-2003 02:31 AM:

$750? Thats nothing. Move to Sonoma County California. Living in Grape fields for more than $1200 a month is highly over rated.

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Posted by Remora on 02-22-2003 03:18 AM:

750? I'm gonna pay 100 bucks more for a mortgage and get a HOUSE

Posted by Orange on 02-22-2003 07:20 AM:

D00d. Where'd you buy a house at?

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Posted by Stealth on 02-22-2003 06:03 PM:

that 100 bucks is to pay for one of those industrial wooden boxes that they put on containers.

he's going to live in it

__________________
VolitionWatch Website Manager

Posted by Remora on 02-22-2003 08:25 PM:

That's about all an apartment is these days hahaha ...

ORNAGE: haven't bought it yet, I'm approved on a loan ... looking in Eagan, BV, AV area.

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