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KMN, please typer slower, so much typos.

But hey, EA advanced very quickly after the EA-Minbari war.
The primary reason for this very fast technologial advancement was fear. They feared that someday the Minbari or another race would come and finish the job the Minbari begun. They wanted new ships and weapons that can destroy Minbari vessels.

Now, the Narns also fears and hates the Centauri. But the reason why the Narns didn't advanced so quickly was lack of resources. The Centauri conquered the Narn homeworld and took almost all resources from there before the Narns revolted. And later, the Centauri bombed the Narn homeworld by mass drivers.

The Minbari didn't feared much any other race except the Shadows, but the Minbari built their fleet of Sharlins for the next Shadow War. They did well, so they really don't have any reasons to quickly research new technologies. The WhiteStar project was first major scientific and technological advancement for the Minbari after current Sharlin design.

The Centauri, after their homeworld was bombed, they begun to reconstruct their cities and soon new fleet designs were planned. Drakhs were involved in this. We don't know what the new fleet looks like, but possibly Octurions and Rutarians will be this new fleet. In books it was said that new Centauri fleet is bigger than any other single race's fleet, including the Minbari and EA.

So, there is a clear reason why the humans advanced so quickly when compared to other races. Other didn't have good reasons or resources.

And now we come to my point:
If ISA really badly wants to get to Vorlon homeworld.
They can quickly research new technologies, new ships, improve their normal tech. Give technology to other member races and so on. EA and Minbari developed and built two Victory class destroyer prototypes, the destroyers already had a Vorlon main gun, unfortunately it drained almost all available power but they still have it nevertheless. This indicates that ISA's tech is not that far away from the Vorlons tech.

The WhiteStars have bio-armor, perhaps Minbari scientist knows how to build bio-armors for new ships. We don't know if Victory and Excalibur was supposed to have bio-armors or not. But because the ISA already have ships with bio-armors, they can relatively quickly learn how to build new ones. Once again new area between Vorlon and ISA tech is filled.


Weeeh! 100th reply!

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arghhhh - the vorlons gave them the bioarmour and taught them how to build it - it would have taken them thousands of years to develop it on there own - the narns had plenty resoarces they had loads of ships and were perfectly capable of getting reasources from space too - they just aren't the scientist type - the white star isn't really much of an advancement other than its jump drive and the armour which was discussed ealier and the vicotry was built by humand and intergrates minbari tech but lot of it is terran including the armour which you'll notice if you look closely at the textures is very similar to that on the warlocks main armour plate section so i think that refractive armour is a human invention - and they didn't have bio armour

and there is no way any human or minbari is goign to survive traveling to the vorlon homeworld even now its not occupied

remember the vorlons and shadows have been out in space for billions of years they are very advanced - infact it spoils the whole story of b5 if they aren't so far ahead of us its frighning what the point in oh look at that thats a neat trick but give me 5 years of reseach and i'll do that too nope they are along way ahead of us only by the time sol blows that we could hope to stand against the vorlons

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quote:

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but lot of it is terran including the armour which you'll notice if you look closely at the textures is very similar to that on the warlocks main armour plate section so i think that refractive armour is a human invention - and they didn't have bio armour

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quote:

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and there is no way any human or minbari is goign to survive traveling to the vorlon homeworld even now its not occupied

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As far as I know, the Narns didn't have that much ships at all.
And homeworld is always the primary source of resources, but the Centauri took almost all resources from there before the Narns revolted. Yes, they can have resources from other planets as well, but they also needs resources to do it, which normally is from the homeworld.

And KMN, just how many race have studied all of it's tech itself?
Every race have stolen, captured or traded technology. Even Firstones. We don't know, but it can be that Vorlon's have stole some of it's tech from other firstones when they were still young like humans are now.

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The Vorlons did seem quite sure that nobody would be able to reach the Vorlon homeworld for one million years when they said it through Lyta.

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back then there were very few reaces aroudn to steal from there was teh shadows at a similar tech level as the vorlon and lorian race probally a couple of thousand years ahead but they probally didn't do much stealing from

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To the armor issue:

The JMS story "hiddeng agendas" mentioden that the Warclocks hull is made of "plasteel". In Acta, they said that Victorys hull was made of "plasteel-crystalline alloy" and that it could refract 70% of weapon energy.

So it could actually be that reflective armor is a human invention.

Well the Shadows were one of the first to explore the rest of the galaxy but there is nothing to indicate that the Vorlons were around in those early days. Who knows, they could have been conquered by the Shadows, liberated themselves, etc. just like the Narns. On the other hand, they could have been the first ones to actually develop the jump gates. There is no way to be sure either way.

Just because you are a fan of one or the other doesn't mean that that race developed a certain technology first either.

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lorien said they found the shadows and vorlons and taught them - i think they were pretty much aroudn at the same time i woul d also say that proor to the falling out over tactics in the teach the younger races episode there is no evidence to suggest the shdaows and vorlons weren't friends prior to this everyone just assume they were always enemys i think the in show dialogue suggest strongly otherwise

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True, they do appear to have been at least allies, trusted by Lorien and that's saying a lot. I was just idly speculating about the histories of the Shadows and Vorlons. Let's not forget that their past probably included a lot of the same history as the new younger races (including Lorien being a father figure).

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Back on vorlon organic tech, they have a very deceptive tech, from the outside the it looks primitive from a shadows point of view but put a couple of pieces of vorlon ship together it will eventually form into the original ship, shadow organic doesn't seem to do this, their ships are grown but when blown up they don't come back together.Now that is pretty darn advanced to have a ship rebuild itself after being blown completely apart.
That my 2c worth

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hey hey, this topic has lasted longer then the Bintak one. Actually, the Bintak, then EA tech, then EA/Minbari War one. At least this one has stayed somewhat on track.

p.s. The Shadows still rule. Forget the Vorlons and all their logic and order, embrace chaos, conflict. It's the only way to get ahead, through struggle, pain, and competition

where did you see this thing about vorlon ships reforming? i knwo they can morph but i never seen one recoallse

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And what the hell you mean by "morphing"
Only "moprhing" they can do is to open/close their wings.

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nope a tentile grow ou of koshes ship and formed a weapon on the end to blast sheridan if he came any closer he backed off then tentcle went away again - also they morph into doors etc when people enter or leave ths ship

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Ahh, perhaps that's an ability of bio-armors.
Shadow ships also have similar ability, they don't have visible doors to let pilots inside and they trapped Garibaldi's fighter by simple flyby.

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i never said shadow vessels couldn't =)

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Its from the short story written by JMS Hidden Agendas.
Sheriden took 6 parts that was left from Uklesh's ship back to B%.It later became 5,4,3 etc to eventually it formed back to its original shape.Later on Sheriden went inside and used the ship to rid Ivanova's warlock of shadow tech, by the way her warlocks name was Titans
Heres an excert

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Afterward, it had been home to the ship that carried Kosh's replacement, Ulkesh, a much darker and ominous Vorlon. Ulkesh had not cared for Humanity the way Kosh had, was even found to be working against Humanity's interests during the Shadow War. At the end it came down to a pitched battle between Ulkesh and Sheridan's forces, a battle that was tilted in Sheridan's direction only by the presence of the last of Kosh's sentience, which had taken up root in Sheridan.
Ulkesh's ship had been destroyed in that battle, broken into six roughly equal sized pieces. Sheridan had ordered the pieces brought to Bay 13 for study. The next thing he knew, the six pieces had become five, five had become four, and it became quickly apparent that the ship was rebuilding itself, extruding tiny tendrils to reattach and repair the broken sections, slowly regenerating those parts that had been destroyed.

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not to be negative but removing the shadow tech from the warlock??? why? all warlocks have shadow teach in them - gives them great sensors - abaility to go further off the subspace beacons - better weapons the works - thats the whole thign about teh warlock it has shadow tech - and about teh vorlon ships was by jms????? if so i guess its pretty much cannon vorlonships hard to kill - but surely it would have objected to its master having been killed and i doubt sheridan could control it but if written by jms i guess it has to be =( hmmmmmmm confusing stuff

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